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Offline CaptainTrips

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2018, 04:35:32 PM »
*Originally Posted by Dilbert [+]
I suggest practicing torque setting on your chosen torque wrench on a bolt head in a vice, this should help you correct any mis-settings in future.

As an apprentice I snapped many an M6 tap (1/4"UNC) in aluminium (aloominum) castings, before getting a feel for what was right and what was too much force, it's the same with tightening any screws/ bolts, especially in aluminium alloy castings, you get a feel for what's tight enough, unfortunately there's only one way to learn what's "too tight"  :034:
Agreed, but it is still easy to make mistakes. On this side of the pond, the available torque wrenches don't have an Nm scale. So first, you have to convert to ft/lbs (or inch/lbs) and then use the correct scale (the other side is metric kgs). That's two opportunities to make a mistake.

And then there are the wrench ranges. Many people think that they will only need one torque wrench, but you really need two or three with different ranges (smaller drive wrenches have lower ranges, so you also need a full set of adapters). If you try to set a 6 ft/lb torque on a wrench that has a 200 ft/lb maximum, you are almost guaranteed to over-torque because the minimum torque on that wrench will not be accurate. It is best to use the wrench (with adapters) that allows you to keep the requested torque in the middle of the wrench's range.

Also, it is nearly impossible to get a good feel for the torque that you are applying, if the torque is low and you are using a wrench with an 18 inch handle.
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig

Offline vsteel

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2018, 06:10:14 AM »
*Originally Posted by CaptainTrips [+]
On this side of the pond, the available torque wrenches don't have an Nm scale. So first, you have to convert to ft/lbs (or inch/lbs) and then use the correct scale (the other side is metric kgs). That's two opportunities to make a mistake.

I find that the torque wrenches now have both NM and FT-LBS (the ones I do have them both).  I don't have a large one though, once you get over 150-200 FT-LBS I just horse them down as hard as I can and call it good.   

I prefer the beam type, I like the feel of reaching the torque value rather than the break over of the clicky ones and no batteries needed.   

Offline Dilbert

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2018, 02:26:41 PM »
Aye-aye Capt, we've just supplied a Robotic arm to site (think automotive assembly/ welding robots), 16x M24 (1") bolts at 650Nm, the torque wrench has a two foot long handle and then an extension to get enough pull on to torque the bolts down, don't fancy using one of those to "nip-up" a bike's drain plug  :008:


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Offline CaptainTrips

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2018, 04:34:24 PM »
*Originally Posted by vsteel [+]
I find that the torque wrenches now have both NM and FT-LBS (the ones I do have them both).  I don't have a large one though, once you get over 150-200 FT-LBS I just horse them down as hard as I can and call it good.   

I prefer the beam type, I like the feel of reaching the torque value rather than the break over of the clicky ones and no batteries needed.
Yeah, being in a metric country, we seem to get the metric scale rather than NM. I have yet to see ANY application with a documented metric torque value for a vehicle -- entirely useless.

I tried a beam type torque wrench, but they are impossible to recalibrate. I have a digital torque display socket extension that allows me to check and compare torque values across all my wrenches. And click-style wrenches have an adjuster. You are supposed to store the click style wrenches with 10% of the max load on them, but hobbyists often store them away with the last torque value used, which can cause them to go out of spec over time.
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig

Offline Dilbert

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2018, 12:52:31 PM »
*Originally Posted by CaptainTrips [+]
Yeah, being in a metric country, we seem to get the metric scale rather than NM. I have yet to see ANY application with a documented metric torque value for a vehicle -- entirely useless.

Nm (Newtons x metres) is the ISO metric unit, ft/lb comes from your imperialist colonial origins  :086:

We tend to get metric units more in the UK (what with Newton being of English stock), but we can still get some torque wrenches in dual units, tend to get Nm values for M (Metric) size screws and ft/lb values for Inch size screws (vintage cars, bicycles, etc).


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Offline vsteel

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2018, 03:54:13 PM »
*Originally Posted by CaptainTrips [+]
Yeah, being in a metric country, we seem to get the metric scale rather than NM. I have yet to see ANY application with a documented metric torque value for a vehicle -- entirely useless.

I tried a beam type torque wrench, but they are impossible to recalibrate. I have a digital torque display socket extension that allows me to check and compare torque values across all my wrenches. And click-style wrenches have an adjuster. You are supposed to store the click style wrenches with 10% of the max load on them, but hobbyists often store them away with the last torque value used, which can cause them to go out of spec over time.

You adjust the beam by moving the needle or change the scale, though the idea being a large spring that doesn't get that much use, you shouldn't need to adjust it.   I should take mine to work and run them through our 17025 calibrations and see how close they are. 

I use NM and FT-LBS all of the time, I seem to get a 50/50 mix.   I have a 91 GMC Sonoma pickup where the motor is standard while the body is metric.  I learned mix and match a long time ago.  :152:

Offline CaptainTrips

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2018, 04:27:58 PM »
*Originally Posted by Dilbert [+]
Nm (Newtons x metres) is the ISO metric unit, ft/lb comes from your imperialist colonial origins  :086:

We tend to get metric units more in the UK (what with Newton being of English stock), but we can still get some torque wrenches in dual units, tend to get Nm values for M (Metric) size screws and ft/lb values for Inch size screws (vintage cars, bicycles, etc).
The 'other' scale on my three torque wrenches is M / KGS.
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig

Offline CaptainTrips

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Re: Did I mess up oil change torque settings?
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2018, 04:31:26 PM »
*Originally Posted by vsteel [+]
You adjust the beam by moving the needle or change the scale, though the idea being a large spring that doesn't get that much use, you shouldn't need to adjust it.   I should take mine to work and run them through our 17025 calibrations and see how close they are.
I once bought a Craftsman beam torque wrench and immediately discovered that the head was actually loose on the shaft. Turn it one way and it sat at 0. Turn it the other way and it sat at 6 ft/lbs. I returned it.
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig

 


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