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Offline itchyfeet

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Final drive oil all over back wheel
« on: March 17, 2019, 04:35:33 PM »
Hi all,
         I've just got back from a two up gentle jaunt to the seaside, when i got off at home I noticed the back tyre on the swingarm side and the final drive covered in oil. I initially thought one of the fill/drain bolts on the final drive had worked loose and dumped the oil, on closer inspection they seem perfectly tight. I've removed the back wheel and there is a lot of oil inside the final drive where the wheel spindle would be if there were one.
         There must be an oil seal inside there, can anyone talk me through what may be going on and is this a DIY fix?

The last few turnings to get me home were all left handers (where the oil was) how bloody lucky was I not to come off!!


Oh its a 2014 gen 1 if that makes a difference. 50,000 on the clock

Online T800XC

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2019, 04:51:30 PM »
...Desire ends in satisfaction...

Offline itchyfeet

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2019, 05:14:17 PM »
Yeah thanks just found them. In yours you said you made a simple jig to pull the oil seal out? can you explain to me what that was please. I get the drilling bit and inserting self tappers just not the 'simple jig' bit

ta

Online T800XC

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2019, 06:00:09 PM »
I'll dig out and post some photos when at my PC tomorrow.
...Desire ends in satisfaction...

Offline itchyfeet

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2019, 08:36:04 AM »
I'd appreciate that T800XC  thanks.

Online T800XC

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2019, 07:32:41 PM »
I couldn't find decent photos of the final solution, so I've added a couple of original photos of the leaking seal plus some drawings of what I ended up using to remove and refit the seal.


This was the state of the final drive on my Explorer before the repair:-



This is what the seal looks like when the aluminium cover is removed (tap it out from the opposite side):-



Here's the seal with 2 holes drilled at 9- and 3-o'clock. These were 2mm diameter holes drilled VERY carefully and slowly using a variable speed cordless drill. The outer surface of the seal is rubber (nitrile I think) but the main body under the coating is steel so a sharp drill bit is needed. I stopped the drill as soon as the hole was through in order to avoid damaging the bearing behind the seal:-



To remove the seal, the following 'seal puller' was made (dimensions are shown in additional images below). The centre screw is a 25mm long M8x1.25 stainless socket cap head and the two smaller screws are No4 x 25mm stainless self tappers with the sharp point ground to a flat finish. I used one extra self tapper with its sharp point intact to get the thread started through the wall of the seal, before using the flattened screws shown. The transparent object in the image is the rear drive shaft through the centre of the bearing and seal:-


This image shows the dimensions of the steel (or aluminium) plate used for the 'puller':-


This image shows the dimensions of the aluminium boss that's inserted into the drive shaft for the M8 screw to push against:-




This shows the bearing behind the seal, once the seal had been removed:-



After thoroughly cleaning the centre shaft to remove any dirt or corrosion, the new seal was carefully placed in position with plenty of oil to help lubricate:-




At this point the seal has to be VERY CAREFULLY pushed home. The following images show a nylon 'drift' that I made to help ensure that the seal goes into position as straight as possible. The long shaft on the drift inserts into the centre of the final drive. A rubber mallet is used on the back end of the drift to gently tap the seal into position.





Hope that helps.
...Desire ends in satisfaction...

Offline Stillwobbling

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2019, 09:00:07 PM »
Tremendously useful. Pictures really help. I take it that the bearing itself was ok? Very often the cause of seal failure is movement in the shaft or bearing causing excessive flex in the seal material. Sometimes it's age just hardening them.

Do you think it's worthwhile making some caps to block the central hole through the middle?  Does grit and grot get onto the seal through there?

Offline itchyfeet

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2019, 09:43:19 PM »
Thats really useful. Thanks for taking the time to post them. I don't have a lathe but I'm quite sure i can make something work.

i've ordered one 22mm and one 60mm blanking cap to seal off both ends of the shaft afterwards. Found the seals on amazon.

cheers.

Offline pug27

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2019, 09:59:09 AM »
Very good post T800XC.
I've also just noticed a small well of oil in between the spindle and aluminium outer plate and although its not spilling out yet I'm sure it will be only a matter of time.

Have you given any thought, as you seem to have the skill, of making another set of "specialist tools" and selling them? or even lending them out. I would be interested.

Online T800XC

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Re: Final drive oil all over back wheel
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2019, 11:52:09 AM »
*Originally Posted by Stillwobbling [+]
...I take it that the bearing itself was ok?

Do you think it's worthwhile making some caps to block the central hole through the middle?  Does grit and grot get onto the seal through there?
Yes the bearing seemed fine and yes I've fitted blanking caps to block the central hole on both the L & R sides. My feeling is that crud found it's way in between the aluminium plate and the shaft and so built up over a period of time. You can see in my second photo above how much crap was in there. I have a Seal Doctor that I use to clean out the seal on my front forks to prevent them leaking (as they did last year). Having replaced a couple of final drive seals I reckon something similar could be used for periodic maintenance to clean them out. Maybe some thin shim or photo negative material or even the tip of a very small cable tie.

On later Explorer models I think they changed the central shaft to extend it further outwards. I assume this was to help prevent crud getting in there.



*Originally Posted by pug27 [+]
Very good post T800XC.
...Have you given any thought, as you seem to have the skill, of making another set of "specialist tools" and selling them? or even lending them out. I would be interested.
Haven't given this much thought but could be open to the idea.
...Desire ends in satisfaction...

 


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