Author Topic: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development  (Read 1227 times)

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#10

Offline KenW

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Re: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development
Reply #10 on: July 29, 2021, 02:20:16 AM
Thanks Will.  That JCB thing was a very interesting video.

Don't know how big a hydrogen tank would have to be to match 20 litres of petrol.  In the video he says hydrogen is three times as much power as diesel by weight.  So maybe smaller than we'd think.
I imagine there would be less change to a petrol engine than to a diesel engine, to run on hydrogen.
Good on JCB.  They might find they become more an engine manufacturer than equipment.  They don't make buses for example, but that would be a big market for their engine.

Fuel cells get dismissed as too expensive and fragile.  No doubt that will improve with research.
The gamechanger to electric from battery might be solid-state batteries when they crack them.  (Apparently not yet commercial.)
The other thing to keep an eye on is ammonia as fuel.  Easier to transport and store, but I don't know what converts back to hydrogen or electricity.
Meanwhile with any luck, Australia will ramp up at producing rare-earth metals.  Which would make current batteries and associated technology maybe cheaper, but at least less reliant on China.

Motorbikes will have to be weaned off petrol.  We know it's not if, but when.  I wouldn't be surprised if Triumph aren't at least thinking about it.  Maybe even doing some experimenting on the quiet.

What is missing, is the hydrogen delivery system.  But hey, in Australia at least, we have automotive LPG at most service stations, in big tanks.  They weren't there until we introduced LPG for cars, and the government subsidised conversions.  Not much difference.

Sorry, going off thread a bit here.  Maybe this deserves a whole new thread of its own.  It is exciting times for engines.

#11

Online Will Morgan

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Re: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development
Reply #11 on: July 29, 2021, 09:37:48 AM
*Originally Posted by KenW [+]
The other thing to keep an eye on is ammonia as fuel. 

Or growing fuel from algae. Similar to bio-fuel from sugarcane or corn starch but without the need for agricultural land, Locally we have a derelict riverside indutrial site with unusually high security where it was once rumoured the owner was working on this, derived from Chinese experimental research. Apparently all it needs is a convenient supply of flowing water for the hydroponics to feed the algae, hence the riverside location. Claim is it doesn't pollute the river or need huge amounts of energy, just takes time to grow & harvest.

All sounds too good to be true and we know what they say about things like that = it probably is too good to be true (and the local rumours/village gossip has gone very quiet on the subject)  :164: :164: :164:

#12

Online CaptainTrips

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Re: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development
Reply #12 on: July 29, 2021, 03:15:23 PM
*Originally Posted by Will Morgan [+]
Or growing fuel from algae. Similar to bio-fuel from sugarcane or corn starch but without the need for agricultural land, Locally we have a derelict riverside indutrial site with unuy high security where it was once rumoured the owner was working on this, derived from Chinese experimental research. Apparently all it needs is a convenient supply of flowing water for the hydroponics to feed the algae, hence the riverside location. Claim is it doesn't pollute the river or need huge amounts of energy, just takes time to grow & harvest.

All sounds too good to be true and we know what they say about things like that = it probably is too good to be true (and the local rumours/village gossip has gone very quiet on the subject)  :164: :164: :164:
The company that I worked for spent 10 years modeling an algae farm in Arizona to produce jet fuel. They built a pilot plant that still operates, but they ultimately found that it was not feasible. The catch 22 was that algae needs lots of sunlight to reproduce effectively but it cannot tolerate heat. So they tried all kinds of ideas to cool it. Eventually, they considered moving the whole process underground using the land surface for solar cells to power LED lights. It was crazy. They would have needed an area the size of Arizona to produce enough jet fuel to power the US airline industry, which was the objective. In the end, they started growing algae for cosmetics and other uses.

Ammonia is a deadly gas. A few wiffs of it will destroy your lungs. It is still used in some older ice arenas as a refrigerant and it kills and injures people when it leaks.

I live very close to Ballard who have worked on commercial fuel cell technologies for going on 30 years. They partnered with multiple major car manufacturers. They trialled a few busses on the road here 15 years ago. It was never feasible. They changed their focus to small power plants to power homes off the grid, such as summer cottages. Fuel cell technology does not scale down easily. The fuel tanks are high pressure bombs that are difficult to armour for collision certification.

I toyed with the idea of fuel cell drives for blue water sailboats. Clean power and you can drink the exhaust runoff!
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig

#13

Offline KenW

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Re: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development
Reply #13 on: July 29, 2021, 11:52:14 PM
Reeeeeeely going off topic now...
I have a 2004 fridge which contains ammonia, in my caravan.
AFAIK it is still used in those fridges powered by heat, ie three-way fridges used in vans.  They run from mains, battery or gas.
Yes it is toxic.  But I haven't heard of anyone being killed or injured by it in recent times in Australia.
Petrol sniffing however, remains a problem.  That destroys the brain, either killing or leaving the practitioner intellectually impaired.  So much so, that we have a low-aromatics fuel (called Opel) for use in outback regions where our indigenous brethren mostly live.
We've also had people gassed or blown up by LPG bottles in vans and while carried in vehicles.
Last Edit: July 29, 2021, 11:54:16 PM by KenW

#14

Online CaptainTrips

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Re: Triumph announces enduro, motocross lineup under development
Reply #14 on: July 30, 2021, 01:14:35 AM
*Originally Posted by KenW [+]
Reeeeeeely going off topic now...
I have a 2004 fridge which contains ammonia, in my caravan.
AFAIK it is still used in those fridges powered by heat, ie three-way fridges used in vans.  They run from mains, battery or gas.
Yes it is toxic.  But I haven't heard of anyone being killed or injured by it in recent times in Australia.
Petrol sniffing however, remains a problem.  That destroys the brain, either killing or leaving the practitioner intellectually impaired.  So much so, that we have a low-aromatics fuel (called Opel) for use in outback regions where our indigenous brethren mostly live.
We've also had people gassed or blown up by LPG bottles in vans and while carried in vehicles.
I highjacked my own thread  :008:

We had an incident at a small town arena a couple of years ago. Two people died, one was the HVAC guy that the manager called, the other was the manager. No one else was in the building at the time. An older incident happened in a larger arena here. A former Olympic figure skater and coach sustained permanent lung damage. She held her breath and ran for the door, but it was too late.

First responders are very concerned about the emergence of alternative energy sources in vehicles. Electrical fires are becoming more common. It complicates accident scene rescues and fire suppression. They just don't know what they are dealing with when they arrive on the scene. With ammonia, it would be hazmat responders first on the scene.
 
Last Edit: July 30, 2021, 01:17:24 AM by CaptainTrips
"The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test."   --   Robert M. Pirsig